How Ronaldinho Changed Our Business | Dorota Gruszka | Booming Games

iGaming Real Talk is launching a new interview series from BiS SiGMA South America. The event has matured into a perfect melting point for business in Brazil and also Latin American market. In 2 days, we have had conversations with leaders, experts from mature businesses in LatAm and Brazil and we talked about the regulation as well as the state of the market in Brazil after regulation. This series is brought to you by EvoVerse.

They offer custom crypto casino source code so that you can launch your crypto casino the way you want it and you can have full control over your margins and the product. This series is also brought to you by Blockotech which is your go-to platform provider for LatAm market. The Blocko Padel Tour sponsored by SiGMA also brings together global iGaming community with sport, fun, and competition across some of the events. Hello and welcome back to iGaming Real Talk.

We are here at SiGMA Brazil in São Paulo. I have with me Dorota from Booming Games. We know each other for a long time, and I'm a big fan of their mascots, Ronaldinho. This is what I first remember when I think about Booming Games. I think it was like 3-4 years ago. I remember you going around with your mascots at ICE, SBC Lisbon, always with a great smile and great energy.

Yeah, like from there to where we are, how has the journey been for you personally being a head of marketing at one of the interesting slot providers?

So, it's been absolutely great. I really love what is happening currently at Booming Games and how everything works with the marketing. We changed the strategy a little bit this year, which is super cool. I'm very excited about it. So, we're going to try new things and let's hope for the best. We also have a very good product. We increased the game release roadmap from five to six, which is absolutely great.

I usually hear two per month is already great.

No, we do we do a lot. I think there is demand obviously if it wouldn't be we wouldn't do that. So, I think it's very beneficial for us. It's been so far a great year for us and I really look forward to upcoming months to see what's going to happen next.

Cool. I mean, first of all, thank you for accepting the invitation.

It's a pleasure to be here with you.

We were supposed to have a chat, but we didn't manage it at ICE Barcelona, but then you know what I'm most curious about is how do you see the marketing for game studios has changed over the years, you know, for a company like Booming Games as well. You mentioned that there is a little bit of change in the strategy. So, what were the things you have seen over the years that changed and maybe those influenced the change in your strategy as well.

Yeah, definitely marketing is still shifting, but I'll be 100% honest with you. I would like more bold moves. I think we are at the stage that over the past years I didn't see a campaign that would blow my mind off or would be super exciting. So, I think we would need to be more bold in our marketing and in our decisions and I think I really miss that a lot.

In specific channel like bold being bold on LinkedIn, being bold at expo floor or do you mean through the product and the games themselves?

I think all of it actually. And especially you mentioned products, I think it would be fantastic to see something new. There is just a couple of software providers that they literally push the limits.

Yeah, like No Limit City for example. That, yeah.

Yeah, I mean I was watching the podcast with Alex and the owner of No Limit City who exited, right? Their story is amazing. Like they came up with completely new concept when it was non-existent. So, do you think something else is happening? There's some new game like CCTV game that is also like I'm hearing a lot.

Uh-huh. Do you think things are changing, new things are coming up?

I think so. I really hope so at least. And as you said No Limit City, they are super bold and they put themselves often in trouble because for example some operators would reject their games because they are too edgy. In my opinion, they are amazing. Like I really love the product.

I think we need to see something different than just the fruity slots, you know, or buffalo games, etc. There is so many themes that literally every game provider have and I would like to see something completely different. I think also them our new product live slots is something that you have game presenter presenting the slots and I think this is something super cool as well. We already got initial feedback from operators that it's actually very very good.

I think when you play just a game on your phone or on your desktop, it might become quite boring. But if you have a human interaction. So, if you have someone who would cheer on your wins, who would talk to you and reply to your messages because it's also a live chat is included in this product so we can interact with the presenter. And I think that's absolutely stunning. And it can be extremely beneficial for the software providers.

Is it already live or is...

Yes, it is live. It is live. It was exclusively live with one operator, but now we are open to welcome more operators to join us in this fantastic journey.

How they actually play? Do they communicate? Is it almost like live casino?

Exactly. Exactly. So, there are studios with the screens and everything. I know live casino... You play through the dealer kind of.

Yeah, exactly. So, you play like regularly and but then the presenter is interacting with you. So, also saying like for example, who is the biggest winner of the round or there are also drops in this. So, there are like a promotional tools included in this product as well. So, every now and then we would have like money drop and stuff like that, which is again increasing the interaction with players. Okay, that's great.

And of course, Booming Games have been in the market for a long time. Now, we are here in Brazil. When it comes to your approach for Brazil as well as the wider LatAm itself, how do you promote your games in a very competitive market, so to say?

It is very competitive market. I think what we did, which is absolutely stunning and it still worked magic for us, it was the collaboration with Ronaldinho. I'm talking especially in Brazil here. We are also certified in Peru. Okay, let's just focus on Brazil since we are here. It was absolutely incredible move from our side to partner with him. We are one of the first sovereign providers being certified for Brazilian market. It opened a lot of doors for us.

We got direct integration with top tier operators in Brazil due to that collaboration with Ronaldinho. And definitely Ronaldinho is still the icon.

Yeah.

He is not playing anymore, but he is an incredible entrepreneur. No doubt about it. Like he's the king, yeah. So, he does everything. A lot of partnerships, a lot of collaborations with different brands. So, he is still very loved by Brazilians and by people in the world in general. And I think having a person like this as a brand ambassador just gives a lot of benefits.

Yeah, and I think it also brings you closer to the players, right? I think maybe 8-10 years ago, there wasn't much disconnection before because it was mainly through B2B roads. But, you know, as we know, some companies started doing it and then I think the ambassador as a channel has increased its popularity and I see it's working very well for you as well.

It is and but I think you have to be very careful who do you choose for the ambassador of your brand. For us, it was perfect. Especially, we really wanted to be in Brazil. We wanted to be strong in Brazil. So, that was like the gold move, I would say, from our side.

I mean, congrats on that success.

And also at the rest of the things that you asked me in that question is obviously we use streamers to target more B2C because as a social game provider, obviously, you need the perfect relation between operators, but you can never neglect or forget about who's actually going to make you money.

And so you always need to ensure that you have great collaborations with local streamers about localization of the content is critical, in my opinion.

But do you also see any challenges working with streamers? Because as we need as we see like many of them could be not true as they project they are.

Yeah. So, this is a good and bad thing. So, you can buy anything in life, as we all know, and streamers also, you can buy them. But, that's why you have to choose the streamers that they will be very honest about your product, even if it might come out that it's not fantastic.

Yeah.

Because that's at least authentic. If you're going to pay streamer and everybody see that the game is like, "What? And the streamer is like, "Oh my god, free spins. What?" It's unauthentic. It's completely unauthentic. So, you have to be authentic in what you do and who you work with.

Obviously, it comes with challenges because the streamers that actually will tell the truth, they would have millions and millions of followers across different channels and they literally don't care much. So, that's the challenge. If people have a lot of money, then yeah, it's just challenging. Yeah, they literally don't care much. So, so I think that also, you know, affiliation...

And I also heard it's very hard to maintain a relationship with streamers unless they have a managers or something, you know?

Exactly. And they are like divas. I mean, good for them. I would love to be a famous streamer, but yeah, I'm not, so I need to stick to what I do and...

Yeah, yeah.

So, what matters like how to keep those relationships? Because, you know, I was talking to another operator and an agency as well. He mentioned like it's really hard to get along with streamers. Like, you know, I may say something and 2 weeks later he says, "Yeah, man, you know, they don't reply much" kind of thing. So, is it really a challenge or how do you maintain your relationship?

It is a challenge. It is a challenge. How you maintain it is, except for the just the paid money, obviously, you send them gifts, you invite them for events, etc. Take notes. So, then to, you know, to build this relationship and then to make them feel special. And also, I think investing in good merchandise for streamers is extremely important because then when they stream, they would have your T-shirt, they would have your whatever, you know?

For example, Pragmatic Play, they have the chairs, yeah? That all respectable streamer have. So, imagine like shipping a chair to a streamer in Brazil or whatever. Maybe they produce it here, I don't know. Or, you know, tickets for football games, anything that they like. You need to spoil them a little bit, yeah. But it's the same working with our brand ambassadors. It's the same thing. It's very very challenging. It's always stressful.

You never know until the very end if they promised you that they're going to show up if they're actually going to show up.

Wow.

So, it's a lot of pressure, but I like pressure. Otherwise, I wouldn't be able to work in marketing and events, you know? It's always a... I'm actually always exhausted before the day that even starts, so. But you were in marketing as well, so you feel me. You know what I'm talking about.

Yes, yes, definitely. You dropped some amazing insights here. I think for anyone starting in B2B marketing or game provider marketing, they have amazing notes to take. But, I also like what you mentioned, you know, it's not about just using it as a channel, but ensuring that there is a fit between the operator and the brand, between the streamer and the brand. And it's only half a side of a coin.

And then, everything else depends on how you maintain the relationship, how you grow the relationship. This is amazing. And what comes to my mind again when we look at Brazil specifically is like, do you think like the player behavior change like pre-regulation to post-regulation? Or they don't really care that much on that level?

I didn't see any changes in players' behavior, but regulations are good, and it's always challenging. This is also one of the biggest challenge in marketing in general to stay compliant, to stay ahead of time, to know about all new... Do you have good relationship with your compliance manager?

Yes.

[laughter] So, it's a lot of things that you have to always keep in mind. And that sometimes I believe that when the regulations are getting out of control, I would say because we have already some markets that they're going to start struggle... Because of the over-regulation.

It's over-regulated. It's absolutely insane. There is like no room for error, no room for freedom, no room for creativity. And then we need to ask ourselves a question like, is it going the way we actually wanted this to go? Because... Especially for marketing, I struggle a lot sometimes because I want to do something and it's like No. No.

I see. I see what you mean. If we look at the next one year, one and half year from where we are here in Brazil as well as the wider LatAm market, do you see any specific trend in game studios, game providers?

I really obviously now that AI is something that everybody talks about. And it's something very strong. And since over the past I would say like 10 years, we've seen very little innovation among slot game providers. So, I really believe that if we would utilize the power of AI the right way, some fantastic products... Are you using any AI with Booming Games? For prototyping, for design, and...

I use AI in my marketing department and the product I don't know exactly. I cannot name the tools exactly what are they using. But in marketing I use a lot of AI. I also I am a part of different AI communities.

Communities. Thank you. Communities in Malta. I think it's extremely important to stay ahead and then not to think that oh, it's not a threat. It's not a threat. It can be very good for us and it can be also very bad. I think so many people they panicked that AI is going to take the jobs and stuff like...

I as well. Me as well. I panicked like a year and a half ago.

I did really? Yeah, yeah. Especially when I was seeing the LinkedIn feed. I'm like, everyone is able to create decent posts. I'm like, where am I going to go? [laughter] That's why you always have to if you need to always utilize it the way that it can bring you clients or money and so on. So, you cannot be afraid of that because it brings it will bring us all a lot of benefits and a lot of people they think about AI just by thinking about oh, chat GPT.

It's completely BS because AI has been with us since like 1950s they started, you know, to it was just kind of given to public... Yeah. 4 or 5 years ago for use of every day person I would say. But before that it was for so many years with us, you know, it was used in so many different levels. So, we shouldn't be afraid. We shouldn't think about that as a threat.

I think in general as humans we had couple of times in the history that people got scared about something new coming in. So, for example, at the end of 19th century, you know, when the electricity kicks in and a lot of people who are doing work manually, they got fired and there was crisis and crash and everybody were panicking. We adjusted as we go, yeah? So, it was I would say like temporary the situation.

Then again, when the computers and mobile phones were invented, it was the same thing because of calculators, you know, printers. There is so many things. Obviously, the AI is the big thing. Yeah. Because the AI is the thing that we need to ensure that we control. Hopefully, I hope it will not get out of control because yeah, we're going to have a robot.

We'll have to transform us. [laughter] Exactly. Yeah.

But it's a very interesting topic. So, I really would like to see but more AI in the product. Mhm. Yeah, this is what I was going to get to. Do you think there is a way AI can help product development in slots specifically? Because you know, I spoke to some companies, Exenia previously and there is some other companies that are doing good job as well in terms of making AI slots like from probably end to end.

Some of them only like prototyping, design, structural thing to kind of speed up the process. But do you think there is something there?

I'll tell you something. I think so, but I'll tell you my personal opinion on that. Using AI is very difficult to get IP on what you do. So, there might be the intellectual property issue while using AI. When we're talking about the slots, you mean?

About anything you do with AI, but about the slots as well because in order to ask AI to create the slot from beginning till the end, you need to share all the knowledge that you have, put it in there and then there is a risk of for example, leaks and then you're going to lose or someone else can utilize your code as well. I don't know how good it is protected for the time being. I wouldn't rely on it 100% even in regards to and stuff.

We do use it, but it's then twisted by our artist. It's still added something on to ensure that it will not look the same on some other game provider site.

Okay. And do you think players would feel the difference or like AI slots versus... I speak so you know, it depends how good it is because AI's for the time being cannot be innovative for the time being. I'm not saying that this will not happen in the future. So it relies only on every information that is anywhere in the internet, yeah? Dorota, thank you so much for joining me and of course sharing your amazing thoughts, insights, as well as great energy and smile too.

Thank you.

Amazing. So that's it. This is iGaming Real Talk. Follow Dorota on LinkedIn. She has a great LinkedIn by the way. 30,000 followers. Over, yeah. Over 30,000 followers, so she posts amazing content as well. Follow her. Follow us as well and I will see you in the next show.